What are you watching these days?

rampaging-poet · Post by **rampaging-poet** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 5:39 am

Corsair114 wrote:I'm watching Shingeki no Kyojin/Attack on Titan at the moment. Also waiting for Arrow to start its second season, but other than that, I don't find myself watching much of anything anymore. I've been too absorbed with my fantasy heart-breaker to have much interest in TV or movies.

I just got caught up on Shingeki no Kyojin myself. I'd read the first volume of the manga, and it was literally detailed to a fault. The art was so detailed it was very difficult to see what was actually happening. The anime is much easier to follow, especially in the action scenes. I also liked the extra background info in the first couple episodes - the manga jumps right from the fall of Shiganshina to their graduation five years later without any hint of what happened in between. My only complaint is the slow pacing: the story is more about the character's philosophies and reactions to war, but the long-winded speeches and internal monologues are a little ridiculous.

I still can't tell whether Armin is supposed to be male or female. I suspect male, but his voice didn't drop nearly as much as Eren's did. I'm pretty sure there was clarification through dialogue at one point in the manga, but it's been months since I read it.

As stated in the anime thread, I've also been keeping up with the various mecha series airing this season. Kakumeiki Valvrave is great, but they love their last-30-second cliffhangers. I had the misfortune of watching episode 10 with my S.O., which was a little awkward. Ginga Kikoutai Majestic Prince has its moments, but the pacing is slow as molasses. I'm two or three episodes behind on Suisei no Gargantia, but the plot was really starting to heat up in the last episode I saw.

EDIT: Quote added due to page break.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:14 am

Yeah. Valvrave and Gargantia are pretty and well made.

Corsair114 · Post by **Corsair114** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:17 am

Just started watching Valvrave, given the above endorsements, figure I'll give it a few episodes to get its footing before I decide whether it's something I want to follow or not.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Sun Sep 22, 2013 8:03 pm

A few days ago, I finally watched Iron Man 3 which... Was OK. I guess. I liked the Mandarin. I liked the action. But the actual story about Tony Stark's emotional growth was flippant and superficial.

The realization that he wasn't powerless without the suit was somehow more impacting with a single line from a kid: "You're a mechanic; build something." Far more impacting than watching Pepper fall into the fire. Both were supposed to be equally valuable lessons that Stark learned, yet Pepper's fall was almost a "whatever."

I also just fucking hate the female-centric false dichotomy of the film: It's me or Iron Man. She knew what she was getting into. The dude is Iron Man. He's also Tony Stark. So why is it a big surprise when he goes off and tries to save the world? Or spends hours trying to improve his suits? Why aren't you doing something because he's not sleeping? Why do you get up and leave him when he's having nightmares? You demand that he's attentive to you, but where's your attention to him? Callous, selfish bitch.

And why the hell does he either have to be an inattentive douche or a totally dedicated significant other? He seriously gives her a giant fucking stuffed bunny for Christmas. Why? Because Tony Stark. What the fuck is that?! I mean, I can understand wanting to give her something unusual and unique - so not jewelry or flowers or some other such stereotypical nonsense. But an oversized, ugly stuffed bunny? What about an island? Or a donation to charity? Or even a giant stuffed Iron Man with a fucking Santa hat on it (fulfills the self-centered douche role, while at least making some sort of sense)? And, of course, the proper correction to this problem is blowing up Iron Man.

The whole internal story was so messed up that the after-credit scene ended with reassurance that this wasn't the end of Iron Man. Because after that fucking mess the audience seriously had to be fucking told, in honest-to-god writing.

---

And today, I watched the animated movie, Epic. I liked it way more than Iron Man 3, and couldn't figure out for the life of me why it was reviewed so relatively badly. So I read some reviews and now I understand why... Apparently all movies that involve normal humans becoming involved in the world of Nature are now compared to Fern Gully and Fern Gully: Blue Avatar. Fuckers. Fucking fuckers.

The common thread throughout this film isn't Humans V. Nature. It's all about loss. MK's mom died, after she left MK's father because of his crazy quest. MK felt like she didn't have a father because he was always off on his crazy quest. Ronin lost the Queen when she became Queen... And then again when she died. Nod's father died. Mandrake's son died. The phrase, "Many leaves, One tree," doesn't refer to the fact that we are part of Nature and it's part of us. It's saying that you're not alone, even though we often think we are. And just to emphasize the point that it's not Humans V. Nature, in the end, it was human technology that actually allowed the Leafmen and the Humans to be together even though size (and speed) were both barriers.

And then...

I love the fact that the father was right. Unlike many stories (Iron Man 3) where someone on a bizarre life quest loses everything because of neglect, I really like the fact that in the end, rather than swing to the far extreme of giving up his life's quest, he learned moderation. His family saw that he was right and joined him in his work, but he also learned to not become so absorbed in his work that he neglected those he loved.

I found a black Queen Tara to be rather... out of place. I have no problem with Queen Tara being black. Or voiced by Beyoncé. But it was how unique blackness was to the movie that just didn't feel right. I think I saw two other black Leafmen in one frame at the very end of the movie. I wish there had been more diversity throughout the rest of the film. Really, though, I think the Leafmen should have been more green. But that's just me.

I loved a lot of ideas in Epic. The Tree of Knowledge was awesome. I loved the speed difference between the macro and micro worlds - it lent itself to a good plot device. I loved the special effects of Queen Tara. Her walking on water was neat. I loved the mouse - it was a great lesson in perspective.

And the movie was fucking beautiful. I may have been just watching it on my normal TV, but it was gorgeous. More than a couple times I got confused because it seemed like they were using real-life video footage.

Lastly...

To the fucking fucks too stupid to understand it... The fruit fly didn't die because of his short lifespan. He was murdered. It was supposed to be foreshadowing the fact that Mandrake was there.

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:18 am

The Tony/Pepper relationship never really clicked for me. It sat even less well with me in Iron Man 3, but I wasn't able to really put a finger on it before Maj's post. There's clearly problems with the relationship, but neither of them appear to know what those actually are. Which is, I guess, par for course for Tony Stark, and probably what we should expect from anyone crazy enough to start a relationship with him.

Maxus · Post by **Maxus** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:54 am

The "Suit is an emotional crutch" thing is a pure contrivance for this third movie to try to retroactively impose some character growth arc on Tony Stark.

It really came off heavy-handed.

erik · Post by **erik** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 3:13 am

I'd rather hope that Pepper would be smart enough not to get involved since she has a fairly good view and concept of how ridiculous it would be to have a relationship with Tony since she doesn't want him to go about being in danger and he out and out tells her that is what he is going to do.

But Gwyneth Paltrow is almost too cute not to cast as a love interest. I'd like to see Pepper as an independent woman who knows better (basically as she is in the start of the 1st movie, and give her some of her own life as well... make her the Fox to RDJ's Batman), but the temptation must be strong to write Paltrow as an attachment instead.

Chamomile · Post by **Chamomile** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 4:17 am

Giving Pepper a life outside of Tony would definitely do wonders for her character.

PhoneLobster · Post by **PhoneLobster** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 4:53 am

Maj wrote:And today, I watched the animated movie, Epic. I liked it way more than Iron Man 3, and couldn't figure out for the life of me why it was reviewed so relatively badly.

I would suggest it was simply reviewed badly for being stereotypical, shallow and with uninteresting characters.

But personally I disliked it for various specific reasons.

As a professional supernatural wilderness creature horticulturist I found it's depiction of nature, how it works and what threatens it, to be deeply offensive. SO offensive that even if you pretend that it wasn't central to the story (and it WAS rather central, it only seems otherwise, because there wasn't much of a story) that even then it was still offensive.

The whole good/evil plants/vs rot/entropy is so... just wrong. Plain old die back, death, rot, entropy whatever is an integral part of nature and in a balanced ecosystem does not prevent a healthy forest, and is VITAL to a healthy forest. SNAILS should have fucking KNOWN that. And the whole "we can just fix the acres of dead forest in five minutes or less with magic!" time scales were deeply offensively wrong and just... yeah it ALL rubbed me the wrong way and felt like it was giving kids the impression that a dead leaf was an evil sign of evilness, the most dangerous thing to the health of a forest is an evil pixie, and it's cool because good will triumph and we can just wave a fucking magic wand and make it better.

That ACTUALLY offends me. As someone who's job it is to go around and wave that fucking magic wand it is NOT THAT FUCKING EASY. And the forces opposing me are not a fucking dead leaf pixie who exudes evil flavoured autumn attacks.

BUT, offensive feel of the nature stuff aside, shallow story aside...

There was a bigger damn issue.

The father/daughter then the daughter/obligatory romance since female leads aren't allowed to stand alone etc...

There WAS an underlying theme of the story and it was some sort of horrid abusive relationship/stockholme syndrome BULLSHIT.

The story CRIED OUT for the lead female to SCREAM at that fucking immature male romantic lead at SOME point something along the lines of "I Hate you, you immature irresponsible self centered dumb fucker, YOU ARE JUST LIKE MY FATHER", and then to learn her damn lesson dump the jerk and save the day WITHOUT him and leave him to ROT.

Because THAT was the theme I picked up. Her father's selfish immature irresponsible obsessions destroyed his family and hurt her directly, and she was confronted with a would be male romantic interest who was deeply immature and who's irresponsible obsessions threatened EVERYONE around him, including HER directly. And she fucking fell for the fucker.

And since that theme/dynamic was the only one of any value to the shallow worthless story being as fucked up as it was made the whole movie feel deeply bad.

The massively superior alternative would be for the big twist in the movie to be that the would be male lead was the real bad guy and that his irresponsible nature was the force destabilizing nature and that the lead female didn't need his fucking bullshit. Talk about a REAL inspiring movie for the little girls out there, THAT would have been legendary.

So NO "Epic" was NOT a good movie. It DESERVED to be panned in the reviews. Also. As an aside, that name, no, it did NOT deserve to give itself that name, it was deeply not "Epic".

name_here · Post by **name_here** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:14 pm

Yeah, Iron Man 3 was pretty irritating with the whole thing about having the suit be mutually exclusive with a relationship with Pepper. It's totally possible to do X and still have a relationship. Granted, Tony was getting pretty obsessive with modifying the suit due to wormhole-related trauma, but it's pretty clear that any relationship issues prior to that were due to Stark being a douche and not his suit habits.

Plus, at the end, Pepper gets superpowers. Tony no longer needs to leave her behind when going off to be Iron Man

Also, my deep and abiding hatred of incompetence strikes again!

So at the end, Tony calls up the suits back at his house and they proceed to kick ass. Truly an intelligent and well thought-out... wait one fucking second here. So the other suits are capable of autonomous action, not just the latest generation? Why the hell didn't he summon them previously? For instance, when his house was getting bombarded with rockets! He didn't have to choose between suiting up to fight and giving Pepper armor, he could have done both! What's really annoying about it is that plan actually occurred to me while the first attack was happening. Incidentally, I thought the Arc Reactor provided the suits with power, but then again it's not like anything is stopping Tony from making more to install in the suits.

Oh, and the bit with stealing the Iron Patriot suit. I kind of thought those things were complicated. How'd the guy figure out how to operate it perfectly so fast?

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:01 pm

I didn't have the problems with Epic that you did, PL - for two reasons:

1) I've both studied and taught botany, ecology, and horticulture. I understand the nature-includes-life-and-death thing (I was kinda hoping that because of the conflict, the sprout would end up being both). But I didn't care because this movie wasn't about Nature. It was set in a world that has a forest of magic little people engaged in a never-ending good/evil conflict alongside cars and normal sized-people. There were trees and flowers and other green things in the movie, but the film was not any sort of statement about the environment, how shit grows, or how Nature works. It was not Fern Gully. At all.

2) She fell for the guy after he had his change of heart and stopped being a dumbass. Further, the entire theme of the movie was you're not alone. Having the lead - female or male - end up being "strong" by doing things without the assist of others would have utterly defied the point.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:56 pm

@Maj
have you watched Iron Man 2?
Tony Starks Father WAS RIGHT.
He was just too far ahead of the times.

@Corsair114
A Verdict yet?

Corsair114 · Post by **Corsair114** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:01 am

Stahlseele wrote:@Corsair114
A Verdict yet?

Valvrave was really starting to get interesting right up until the season 1 finale when it pulled and massive "Nothing is what it is" cliffhanger. They kinda sorta spoiled the intrigue of one of the villains, too, but I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and a chance to get everything to a place that makes sense with their second season before passing judgement on the series. I'd say wait until the second season starts (or gets closer to starting, Oct 14) before picking the show up.

PhoneLobster · Post by **PhoneLobster** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:10 am

Maj wrote:...but the film was not any sort of statement about the environment...

It was a film about nature powered fairies having a nature fight in nature. It cannot avoid having underlying statements about the environment, and their CLEAR intention to try and avoid that to pander to certain audiences WAS offensive. If you don't want your movie to be compared to Fern Gully then stop trying to be a "Fern Gully Lite" that is accessible to people who don't want to believe habitat destruction is real.

Pretending it as a movie wasn't clearly jab square in the center of the "nature under threat" genre is absolutely ridiculous.

2) She fell for the guy after he had his change of heart and stopped being a dumbass.

Only, his "change of heart" was about as believable and impactful as a bag full of tribbles. He did NOTHING to prove his supposed non-dumbassness he remained an uninteresting character there was just a scene where the lame ass story simply declared "this is the bit where the reckless hero learns something" and pretended THAT was enough. It is not enough you cannot simply decide you are using the utterly predictable stereotypical plot and then just declare you are ticking the boxes as you go. Your damn characters need to show it, your story needs to tell it. THAT DID NOT HAPPEN.

The story and the emotional impact was so ineptly handled that it had the makings of a far better plot line, about independence and personal strength and walking away from abusive relationships. Ideally the movie should have ended with the lead female taking on the role and powers of the good fairy and the lead male's stupidity and irresponsible selfishness leading to him replacing the role of the bad fairy. THAT would have been brilliant. THAT would have been a story for little girls that would have been GOOD. Because as it stands the story for little girls it presented was "love an asshole, you have no choice!" which had intended to be your typical teenybopper style "love a reckless guy until he shows his secret good qualities and this time for sure learns to respect you" and THAT story, that lame and stereotypical and deeply wrong story is told to little girls in our kids movies over, and over, and over and if a movie for little girls wants to finally be a real success and show some fucking artistic merit it needs to STOP DOING THAT.

Or, if it's going to sell out and do that, it needs to do it a damn sight better than "Epic" did it.

Stahlseele · Post by **Stahlseele** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:27 am

Corsair114 wrote:
Stahlseele wrote:@Corsair114
A Verdict yet?
Valvrave was really starting to get interesting right up until the season 1 finale when it pulled and massive "Nothing is what it is" cliffhanger. They kinda sorta spoiled the intrigue of one of the villains, too, but I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and a chance to get everything to a place that makes sense with their second season before passing judgement on the series. I'd say wait until the second season starts (or gets closer to starting, Oct 14) before picking the show up.

yeah, pretty much what i was thinking as well . .

PoliteNewb · Post by **PoliteNewb** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 4:07 pm

Watched the first episode of "Copper" last night, as I've been hearing stuff about it. Not bad; I'll probably give it a shot.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:44 pm

So, like I said... People didn't like it because it wasn't Fern Gully - PL included.

Whatev.

---

I guess I just have terrible taste in what I watch, then. I tried getting into Copper and just couldn't. But I'm totally into Crossing Lines that was on NBC this summer.

Maybe I'm entranced with the setting of the show... I don't know. I know that the ICC doesn't handle cases as portrayed in the show, and I don't particularly care. I like watching the cases unfold. I like how the characters' stories weave together (though I was admittedly turned off at first by the stories). I like the fact that they're willing to kill off characters in a way that isn't gratuitous. I don't know why Donald Sutherland is on the show - probably name factor - but I like his character. I like how all the characters have a definitive role - they would make a good party for an RPG. And of course, I like listening to all the different accents, and seeing all the different locales.

I like the quiet dignity of the women in the show. Unlike a lot of American shows, the women don't have to be brash and in-your-face in order to stand up for themselves. Unfortunately, it's the women who end up as victims anyway, even though it makes sense given the story. I heard that the show has been renewed in France, so I hope this changes next season.

Corsair114 · Post by **Corsair114** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 11:05 am

Stahlseele wrote:yeah, pretty much what i was thinking as well . .

For what it's worth, I'd say it's the second best mecha show this season after Attack on Titan.

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:58 pm

The pilot of agents of shield was overall very good, but flawed. That's more or less what I expected, but in the opposite areas.

My only complaint is that joss Whedon seemed to be off his game on the quirky dialog front. A lot of the jokes went on too long, and stood out badly from the surrounding scene. I think the show should actually have taken itself a little more seriously and been a little less meta. I hope he finds his stride as it goes on.

However, I was pleasantly surprised by the handling of gender. Whedon's reputation is that he's great on gender, but I don't think he always lives up to it. Buffy was interesting because Buffy and Willow got to be pretty successful at taking life on their own terms, having genuine accomplishments, and being taken seriously. Since then, in angel, dr. Horrible, and dollhouse, he's gotten away from stories about women with power to stories about bad men who victimize women. The thing is shows where the female characters are marginal and victimized are not exactly unique, since you don't have to be a feminist to write one.

This time, he wrote in some truly Hilarious takedowns of masculinity, but focused on exposing the patriarchy's foolishness rather than its malice. Meanwhile, the main female character is awesome, and in exactly the way an analogous male character would be.

nockermensch · Post by **nockermensch** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 10:17 pm

Orion wrote:My only complaint is that joss Whedon seemed to be off his game on the quirky dialog front. A lot of the jokes went on too long, and stood out badly from the surrounding scene. I think the show should actually have taken itself a little more seriously and been a little less meta. I hope he finds his stride as it goes on.

I didn't even watch this show, but this deserves a comment. When an author reads positive critics about his job, I think there's a risk that he'll try to do more of what critics liked, and in the process become less authentic. Pretty much like a "Tarantino Movie" became its own genre these days, maybe Whedon is trying to create "a Whedon series", instead of "a good series".

Cynic · Post by **Cynic** » Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:09 am

I actually liked the fact that it didn't take itself more seriously.

That was one of the failings of Dollhouse. It took itself a little too seriously. There weren't enough jokes. Probably one of the reasons, it didn't really take off.

Firefly also had a *little* bit of the same problem. Granted, I loved Firefly and I did like Dollhouse. But, out of all his works, those are the two least successful shows. SUre they might have cult status but they didn't really work well at the time they came out. Also, I know the whole issue with the studio and moving time slots and all that but that was only part of the problem in my opinion.
--

So I think Agents... is pretty good. It was also interesting that he's gone back to having a *large* Scooby Squad like Buffy (and Firefly to an extent.)

Also seeing Ron Glass in the show was probably one of the more surprising and awesome parts of the casting.

Voss · Post by **Voss** » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:06 pm

Orion wrote:The pilot of agents of shield was overall very good, but flawed. That's more or less what I expected, but in the opposite areas.

My only complaint is that joss Whedon seemed to be off his game on the quirky dialog front. A lot of the jokes went on too long, and stood out badly from the surrounding scene. I think the show should actually have taken itself a little more seriously and been a little less meta. I hope he finds his stride as it goes on.

Personally, I found the attempts at quirky dialogue pretty jarring, and it would be better if he didn't try. The main thing that struck me was that this is the inverse of a typical Whedon show : strong premise (which isn't surprising, since SHIELD has 50 years of background to crib), and really weak characters.

Agent Macho could easily be replaced with a piece of wood, the science twins might be interesting if they were actually a gestalt entity like they pretend to be, but as is, they come across as 'nerds are funny'. The lead agenda is trying and failing to be quirky and his Dark Secret feels like a lodestone. (Calling it now, he's actually an LMD). The only interesting one is the 'driver,' and I suspect she will become less so over time, with a formulaic Tragic Past that will be infuriatingly boring

This time, he wrote in some truly Hilarious takedowns of masculinity, but focused on exposing the patriarchy's foolishness rather than its malice. Meanwhile, the main female character is awesome, and in exactly the way an analogous male character would be.

The main...? Really? I found her an annoying amalgamation of all his past female characters. All their negative traits, and no positive traits to balance it out. Her main motive, which they point out at least three times, is to show up and squee! at heroes. And to confusedly ramble about the Stereotypical Hacker Agenda.

Honestly, the 'takedowns' of masculinity felt phoned in. Wooden macho agent was a helpless sock puppet in the face of a token 'feminist beating.' I've seen more convincing punch and judy shows with a better handle on that message.

The show has potential, but the pilot was pretty weak. After I realized that the hero was the same actor as Gunn, I realized it made the show much better if I just went with the theory that he was actually Gunn.

Sir Neil · Post by **Sir Neil** » Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:37 pm

I hated that hacker. Her lies created every problem in the episode, and the whole time I got the sense the writer wanted us to be cheering for that insufferable brat.

Mike needed a job, and treatment to regulate Extremis. SHIELD offers him both at the end of the episode. If she hadn't lied to him about SHIELD in the beginning they would have been able to help him before he attacked his old boss and endangered everyone at the airport. (Incidentally, her description of SHIELD as "men in suits, scary, scary bad." was really out of place Whedon-speak. It was kind of jarring.)

The truth serum "gag" is another sore spot. I hate mind controllers, and if he'd jabbed me with it and turned me over to the enemy like that I'd have killed him immediately. Well, I'd have tried.

I saw the teaser for the upcoming season. It looks like Coulson is going to use the hacker as a canary, flinging her face first into danger so he doesn't risk decent people. I can live with that.

AIM had almost perfected Extremis before they were taken out by the Iron Legion, so I figure this new group is either the Power Broker or Hydra (hinted at by the assassin in the pilot and the Red Skull gang in the teaser). The Secret Empire as an outlier.

Whipstitch · Post by **Whipstitch** » Thu Sep 26, 2013 4:20 pm

Maj wrote: The whole internal story was so messed up that the after-credit scene ended with reassurance that this wasn't the end of Iron Man. Because after that fucking mess the audience seriously had to be fucking told, in honest-to-god writing. [/spoiler]

---

And today, I watched the animated movie, Epic. I liked it way more than Iron Man 3, and couldn't figure out for the life of me why it was reviewed so relatively badly.

It's not surprising when you consider who the tastemakers are. Plus, nobody was really that big a fan of Fern Gully to begin with--it got more good reviews than bad, but they were of the damning with faint praise/"kids will like it" variety. It's both an archetypal film and a low bar to clear, so if you make a movie that simultaneously reminds your audience of it while also seeming worse in any way, there will be a critical reckoning. Remember, movie critics see a lot of movies, and even the Roger "Judge it for what it is" Eberts of the world get genre fatigue sooner or later.

Meanwhile, Shane Black specializes in one liners, purposely weird pacing, deconstruction and various forms of meta bullshit. His style often gets in the way of traditional storytelling and openly mocks earnestness, but it also results in quality one liners as well as little flourishes that aren't present in most movies--and certainly not in comic book movies. He is the sort of writer who plops down a paint-by-numbers plot with a wink and a nod and then also gives you something like Ben Kingsley Mandarin. In short, it's exactly the kind of thing that tends to annoy traditional audiences that just want a good yarn but functions as comfort food for jaded movie critics and inveterate hipsters.

Voss · Post by **Voss** » Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:20 pm

Sir Neil wrote:I hated that hacker. Her lies created every problem in the episode, and the whole time I got the sense the writer wanted us to be cheering for that insufferable brat.

I got that sense too, and found it to be puzzling. I know some of it is because some people think that hacker groups like Anonymous do something important, but she lacked any redeeming value at all, beyond a hero-groupie fucktoy. Hell, she stole Gunn's driver's license. He literally can't get a job now, you bitch!

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